3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Abaissé re-reads the novel in its entirety! All welcome, no matter whether you're reading in French or some other translation. Discussion topics for each step along the way.

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Col.Despard
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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Col.Despard » Mon Feb 28, 2011 2:55 am

Argh! Your posts are so awesome and dense that I'm having trouble keeping up with any response - I still want to go back and go over Grantaire's Free Pass re modern fanon (agreeing with you that his behaviour is entirely in keeping with attitudes to women, but grumbling a bit about certain fanonical traits relative to this), and then you go and throw all this fun stuff at us! I don't know where to start!

Re: Isabella's Chemise...I've always heard of this in relation to the legendary beginnings of the colour "Isabella" and Isabella of Castile, and I suspect this is what Grantaire has in mind:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isabelline_(colour)

The connection with Isabella of Austria / The Seige of Ostend was a new one on me.

The Gros stuff is fascinating and, I think, one of the most underutlilised aspects of Grantaire's background, although Abelarda is now working with it in a story that has a fascinating premise. Delaroche I tend to think of as "That Execution Guy" due to his penchant for painting executions.

I never picked up on the tennis thing! Probably because I would have glazed past that when reading in my sketchy French (although these are some of the few scenes I can read resonably fluently due to familiarity with translations) and just accepted the English translation. English translations seem to have a huge problem with Savate and Bâton français and just go with "singlesticks", a concept which the English understood (and tennis, which as you say is just a WTF?). You can see how closely they're related - I tend to break them losely into Fighting with Feet and Fighting with Sticks just to keep them apart in my head, but there's a lot of overlap. I noticed that some English translations forgo the later mention of Enjolras using his carbine in the "Covered Rose" move, or call it a singlestick move, but I'm guessing it's Bâton...and useful as a point of convergance for Enjolras and Grantaire if you want to give them some common ground, as it suggests Enjolras was familiar with this method of combat as well (and given how ferociously and effectively he fights as the barricades fall, I'd say he has some serious combat skillz).

I'm kinda going to give Augustin Robespierre a pass with his attempted "I'm outta here" given that there are pretty good odds his brother had just shot himself in the jaw as a failed suicide attempt. No point in standing by your sacrifice if the one you did it for is trying to bail out himself!
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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby MmeBahorel » Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:21 am

I only picked up on the tennis thing because I was double-checking the nouns in French because I suspected when "tennis" wasn't "tennis" that the difference was some precursor to modern tennis or some French form that had died out or something. I really didn't expect it to be completely wrong! Or to later discover a whole pun missing!

An afternoon spent trying to look up Grantaire's rants gives a person a mild headache from squinting at the computer because some of it is simply incomprehensible. (Englishwoman in blue spectacles dancing with a wreath of roses WTF? I blame the subtextual hashish. Some of it is just too out there to be mere alcohol at fault, so it has to be pot.)
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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Col.Despard » Mon Feb 28, 2011 6:41 am

I think one would have to sit down with the Dictionary of Phrase and Fable, drink a lot AND smoke a lot, and then just drag up a whole bunch of half-remembered historical anecdotes before mashing them all together to try and replicate and/or complete follow Grantaire!

BTW - forgot to mention that "Executed Today" is one of my favourite blogs, and one or two that are on my daily list to check in on. It's sent me off chasing all sorts of hares, particularly those executions that occur outside of a European/Australian/US context, and with which I am largely completely unfamiliar.
"The principles of freedom, of humanity, and of justice, will finally triumph over falsehood, tyranny and delusion, and every principle inimical to the interests of the human race" - Edward Despard, 1803

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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Aurelia Combeferre » Mon Feb 28, 2011 10:58 am

Just wondering...Grantaire couldn't have been taking laudanum, right? Not sure if it would have any part to play in his randomness and venting, but it is supposedly what Coleridge was taking when he wrote "Kubla Khan".
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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Ulkis » Wed Mar 02, 2011 4:47 pm

Another thing I like is that despite the grief Hugo gives Aunt Gillenormand for being an old (gasp) and single (gasp), she's the one who find out where Marius leaves. (Which brings me to, come on Marius just take at least some of the money to pay off your debts, since the people who you owe have to eat too.)

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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Aurelia Combeferre » Mon Nov 25, 2013 10:00 pm

November 26, 2013

A Group Which Barely Missed Becoming Historic

http://www.online-literature.com/victor_hugo/les_miserables/176/

An introduction to eight idealists and one skeptic.

This is just to say that of the descriptions here, I find Jehan's most intriguing.
"...all aptitudes having equal opportunity; politically, all votes having equal weight; religiously, all consciences having equal rights."

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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Aurelia Combeferre » Wed Nov 27, 2013 1:32 am

November 27, 2013

Blondeau's Funeral Oration by Bossuet

http://www.online-literature.com/victor_hugo/les_miserables/177/

Bossuet intervenes on Marius' behalf, regardless of the expense involved.
"...all aptitudes having equal opportunity; politically, all votes having equal weight; religiously, all consciences having equal rights."

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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Aurelia Combeferre » Wed Nov 27, 2013 9:57 pm

November 28, 2013

Marius' Astonishments

http://www.online-literature.com/victor_hugo/les_miserables/178/

That feeling of being in a new group and not knowing what to do or say....magnify it a little and that's what Marius is up to here.
"...all aptitudes having equal opportunity; politically, all votes having equal weight; religiously, all consciences having equal rights."

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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Aurelia Combeferre » Thu Nov 28, 2013 9:41 pm

November 29, 2013

The Back Room of the Musain

http://www.online-literature.com/victor_hugo/les_miserables/179/

Pretty much the room where (nearly) anything goes.
"...all aptitudes having equal opportunity; politically, all votes having equal weight; religiously, all consciences having equal rights."

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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Aurelia Combeferre » Sat Nov 30, 2013 12:20 am

November 30, 2013

Enlargement of Horizon

http://www.online-literature.com/victor_hugo/les_miserables/180/

"What greater thing is there?"

"To be free."
"...all aptitudes having equal opportunity; politically, all votes having equal weight; religiously, all consciences having equal rights."

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Re: 3.4 Les amis de l'ABC 24/2/11-1/3/11

Postby Aurelia Combeferre » Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:46 am

December 1, 2013

Res Angusta

http://www.online-literature.com/victor_hugo/les_miserables/181/

Looming hardships and solitude.
"...all aptitudes having equal opportunity; politically, all votes having equal weight; religiously, all consciences having equal rights."


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