A question about Enjolras's name

Any discussion related to Victor's Hugo's Les Misérables, in any language.

A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Finny » Sat May 22, 2010 2:08 am

So, how exactly do you pronounce it.? I'm quite sure I've got the first two syllables right, but I'm having trouble with the third. See, lesmis.com used to have a pronunciation guide with all the names said by Schönberg, but it appears they've removed that. I could've sworn you pronounced the "s" at the end, but I recently got my hands on the audiobook and they reader, whoever he is, is not pronouncing it. Now I'm just horribly confused and thinking maybe I imagined the pronunciation with the "s" or something. Help?
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Roses for Ophelia » Sat May 22, 2010 5:01 am

The s is pronounced but VERY slightly, sort of the same way that a native french speaker would pronounce the 'ble' in 'Misérables' VERY slightly. The audiobook guy is simply wrong. If you listen to the beginning of the ABC cafe/red and black scene on the paris revival cd, when they shout 'enjolras' the s is pronounced slightly. that's the correct pronociation. little things like that annoy me too, like in Troy when they kept pronouncing Menelaus as if the au were one syallable.
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby MmeBahorel » Sat May 22, 2010 6:10 am

That pronunciation thing was horrible, though - for some reason, Lesgle turned into "lay-GLAY". Uhm, no. (also, I've heard the worst attempts at Feuilly - drives me crazy. Victor knew what he was doing with his really bad puns, so pronounce them correctly, dangit!)
What kind of literature and what kind of life is the same question. - Tom Stoppard
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Marianne » Sat May 22, 2010 2:23 pm

Never, ever trust that an English audiobook is correct on how to pronounce French names. :lol:

Also, there's "pronunciation sufficiently correct to not make French-speakers wince when you say it in an English sentence," and there's French pronunciation. The first can be more-or-less approximated by "Ahn-zhol-ras" (where zh=the 's' in 'vision', and stress is on either the first or the last syllable), and the second is something like [ɑ̃ʒolˈʁas]. I stick to the first when I'm not actually speaking French, because trying to shoehorn a word with a nasal 'a,' a French 'r,' and last-syllable stress into an English sentence (a) twists my tongue into knots, (b) sounds pretentious, and (c) runs the risk of people looking at you and going 'gesundheit.' (Ditto 'Les Misérables,' actually: it is much more understandable in English if you tone down the French-ness of the pronunciation, so it doesn't really matter how much or how little a French-speaker would pronounce the 'ble.')

Basically, don't worry too much about being 100% correct, because 100% correct is incomprehensible in English; as long as you're pronouncing roughly the right syllables in the right order, you're fine.
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Finny » Sat May 22, 2010 4:31 pm

Okay. Thanks a lot guys. So I just say the 's' but don't snake it, basically. I guess it's still slightly less confusing than the pronunciation of accio from Harry Potter, which I refuse to say out loud on account that the British audiobook, the American audiobook and the movies all say it differently. It's one of those burning question I've always wanted to ask JKR.
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby 9430 » Sun May 23, 2010 8:01 am

What? They got rid of the pronounciation guide? Well that was silly. I used to point that out to my friends.

(And how do the American HP audiobooks pronounce 'accio'? I know that it should probably have a hard cc e.g. 'akkio' but I've been listening to Stephen Fry read the books since I was 9 and only ever say it 'acksio'. At least I don't pronounce Hermione's name like 'Hermy-own' any more :roll: )
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Marianne » Sun May 23, 2010 12:35 pm

9430 wrote:(And how do the American HP audiobooks pronounce 'accio'? I know that it should probably have a hard cc e.g. 'akkio' but I've been listening to Stephen Fry read the books since I was 9 and only ever say it 'acksio'. At least I don't pronounce Hermione's name like 'Hermy-own' any more :roll: )


It would only have a hard 'cc' in classical Latin, and I always assumed the spells in HP came from some further-bastardized version of medieval Latin, since the wizarding world has plenty of medieval touches. The trouble is that the pronunciation of 'accio' would depend on the dialect of medieval Latin--so it could be 'ak-sio,' it could be 'at-chio,' it could even be 'ak-tsio.' The first one is most likely in English pronunciation... I think. If any medieval scholars want to correct me, go ahead, I'm curious now. :lol:
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby goodythreeshoes » Tue Jun 15, 2010 1:58 pm

I've always said Ehn-Shol-Ras, with the Shol being a soft J. But I think I'm probably wrong.
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby goodythreeshoes » Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:39 pm

Oh, and by the way, does anyone know Enjolras's first name? I've seen him called Marcelin at least twice, Julien, Henri, Marc, and Jehan. I'm not even sure if Jehan is a French name.
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Marianne » Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:47 pm

goodythreeshoes wrote:Oh, and by the way, does anyone know Enjolras's first name? I've seen him called Marcelin at least twice, Julien, Henri, Marc, and Jehan. I'm not even sure if Jehan is a French name.


His first name is never given--only Prouvaire gets a first name in the book.

Jehan is French, although not modern French; it's the obsolete medieval ancestor of Jean.
[Dieu] entend ta voix, ô fille des hommes! aussi bien que celle des constellations; car rien n'est petit pour celui devant lequel rien n'est grand.
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Ulkis » Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:03 am

Is it pronounced the same way? I'm guessing it is, what with h being silent and all but I'm just making sure.
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby 9430 » Sat Jun 26, 2010 10:18 am

Ulkis wrote:Is it pronounced the same way? I'm guessing it is, what with h being silent and all but I'm just making sure.

I think it is, since in the 1956 French film of Notre-Dame de Paris they pronounce it as 1 syllable, and I would trust that over any English versions (which seem to split it into 2 syllables).
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Ulkis » Sat Jun 26, 2010 4:30 pm

Thank you!
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby Mlle Patria » Mon Jun 28, 2010 1:00 am

Oh dear! I've been pronouncing poor Jehan's name wrong and not even realizing it. I have a question about pronounciation and don't think it deserves it's own thread, so I figured I'd ask it here. How does one pronounce Feuilly's name? I've tried to figure it out, but the pronounciation changes every time I attempt to say it!
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Re: A question about Enjolras's name

Postby MmeBahorel » Mon Jun 28, 2010 4:12 am

It's something like "foy-YEE". There's a school of thought that pulls out the "Feu" as a separate syllable (feu = fire) but it's patently wrong. The silk part of a fan is the feuille (foy, rhymes with "boy"), therefore his name is a play on the fact that he is a fanmaker.

And yes, that comes out hideously Americanised, but it's the best I can do as far as text explanations.
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